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"Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 3:03:55 PM   
Maestro

 

Posts: 560
Joined: 10/4/2007
Status: online 		I thought it would be fun and useful to list in here producers who, in our opinion and according to our experience, consistently deliver Plonk of the most inferior quality level.

I can start by nominating Ruffino and Bolla here in Italy. They are well known, widely distributed, and consistently bad.

Another one that comes to mind is Baron Philippe de Rothschild in Bordeaux. Very consistent in delivering disappointment.

Anyone else in an "awarding" mood?
Post #: 1
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 4:41:28 PM   
jhannah27

 

Posts: 523
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Anaheim, CA
Status: offline 		I proudly nominate Bonny Doon Vineyards in Santa Cruz, Ca. 

My wife and I were given a 1 year gift membership in their wine club and with the exception of one wine (a dessert wine of all things), all were miserable dreck. And I think that of the 8 bottles we received, three were so bad that we dumped them out after the first glass or two.  To me, their popularity is merely due to genius marketing directed at the supermarket wine buyer who chooses based on who has the most interesting label.

You read anything ever written on the wine maker at Bonny Doon, and he is always raving about de-mystifying wine and bringing unique and little known varietals to the masses.  While I agree with the sentiment, making overly extracted and uncomplex versions of these varietals does nothing to promote thier uniqueness.  I say pick one or two and really work to do them well, rather than just plant every grape under the sun, hope it grows well in the region, and just try to blend it with every other grape imaginable to hide flaws. 

Bad form, if you ask me. 

Plus it's unfortunate that they are the most widely distributed wine from the Santa Cruz Mountains because there are several wineries making really fabulous wines down there.  Hopefully people aren't using Bonny Doon as a benchmark for the quality of the region as a whole.

As an aside...I have since decided that these friends of ours never actually liked us, and just came to the wedding for a free steak dinner and an open bar. 

< Message edited by jhannah27 -- 7/29/2008 4:51:21 PM >

_____________________________

"Quickly! Bring me a beaker of wine, so that I may wet my mind and say something clever."
Aristophanes 450 - 385 b.c.

(in reply to Maestro)
Post #: 2
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 5:04:58 PM   
Serge Birbrair

 

Posts: 1535
Joined: 4/23/2006
From: Boca Raton, Florida
Status: online 		Perse of France (Pavie, Monbousquet) and Marquis Phillipe, Australia.



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Do you really think you understand terroir!? -

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RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 8:07:30 PM   
cgrimes

 

Posts: 906
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline 		Wishing Tree, Aus
A to Z Vineyards

Wishing Tree is undrinkable.  A to Z generally disappoints.

(in reply to Serge Birbrair)
Post #: 4
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 8:50:34 PM   
duck833

 

Posts: 65
Joined: 5/13/2008
From: Eugene, Oregon
Status: offline 		I have a case of the 2006 A-Z Oregon Pinot Noir and it is drinking very well for a $18 Oregon PN.  Much better than the 2005.

The winemaker basically sources grapes from throughout Oregon, thereby the A-Z name.  The 2006 is quite approachable this year and is a good value in my opinion.

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Go Ducks!!!

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Post #: 5
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 8:53:01 PM   
duck833

 

Posts: 65
Joined: 5/13/2008
From: Eugene, Oregon
Status: offline 		I go to Trader Joe's every once in awhile bottom feeding and have found that most wines there are not very good.  Out of three bottles I buy there I can maybe drink one and the other two go down the drain.

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Go Ducks!!!

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Post #: 6
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/29/2008 8:56:31 PM   
cgrimes

 

Posts: 906
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: duck833

I have a case of the 2006 A-Z Oregon Pinot Noir and it is drinking very well for a $18 Oregon PN.  Much better than the 2005.

The winemaker basically sources grapes from throughout Oregon, thereby the A-Z name.  The 2006 is quite approachable this year and is a good value in my opinion.


I should probably just see it for what it is and get over it.  Just bugs me when it is one of the few OR wines obtainable outside OR.

(in reply to duck833)
Post #: 7
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 12:33:42 AM   
pjaines

 

Posts: 908
Joined: 5/26/2008
From: London
Status: offline 		Maestro,  right with you there with Baron Philippe de Rothschild - cashing in on a name and churning out goo.

I would also suggest any infinite number of branded wines but will go for Penfolds.  All their wines taste the same irrespective of price (apart from the RWT and Grange).

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Post #: 8
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 6:56:01 AM   
Blue Shorts

 

Posts: 314
Joined: 2/5/2008
From: Santa Cruz, California
Status: offline 		Staying on the Santa Cruz theme, I nominate Beauregard Vineyards.  They have (had?) a tasting room on the municipal wharf.  My wife and I want there to taste the wine and left sorely disappointed. The wine wasn't total plonk unless you consider price.  Wine at that ($25 - $55) should be far better than that.

Ironically, I recently heard that the Bonny Doon tasting room is moving to Ingalls St in Santa Cruz and Beauregard is moving into the vacated Bonny Doon site.

_____________________________

The best wine is the one that you haven't yet tried.

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Post #: 9
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 7:09:53 AM   
Hollowine

 

Posts: 329
Joined: 7/25/2008
From: Hood River, OR
Status: offline 		I would probably nominate most wines produced in states east of the Rocky Mountains. I know there are some exceptions such as northern New York for certain varietals, but there is a reason CA, OR and WA have the majority of shelf space in retail. My parents own a timeshare in Branson, MO that claims to be a great southern wine region. I cringe every time my mom says "We know you really like wine so we picked up some extra bottles for you". It's hard to tell if it was the grapes, winemaking, or the ride home in the trunk that makes it so special.

My other favorite was dining at my childhood best friends house in Kentucky. Wife made spaghetti for dinner, he says "Hey, Scott likes wine with dinner do we have any?" The glass poured came from a Kentucky Vintner, half empty bottle that had been sitting in the door of the fridge for who knows how long. Drank the whole glass (best friends will do anything for one another).

(in reply to Blue Shorts)
Post #: 10
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 7:17:15 AM   
pjaines

 

Posts: 908
Joined: 5/26/2008
From: London
Status: offline 		They make wine in Kentucky?  Are you sure it wasn't moonshine?

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Post #: 11
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 7:29:28 AM   
Maestro

 

Posts: 560
Joined: 10/4/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: pjaines

They make wine in Kentucky?  Are you sure it wasn't moonshine?



All 50 US states produce wine.

Here´s an interesting animated map.

(in reply to pjaines)
Post #: 12
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 7:49:46 AM   
pjaines

 

Posts: 908
Joined: 5/26/2008
From: London
Status: offline 		Maestro, interesting link.  How many of those states make drinkable wine?  I mean, Florida Grapefruit wine - holy cow!!!!  I bet even Serge would not touch that.  In England we technically are a wine producing country but I wont touch 99.9% of them.  You either have to be a raving xenophobe or patriotic in the extreme to buy English wine.

For the US I've had wine from all the usual states (Oregan, CA, WA) but I dont think I would feel compelled to rush out and buy Texan or Mississippi wine.


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-- Paul

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Post #: 13
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 8:43:39 AM   
fingers

 

Posts: 729
Joined: 8/26/2006
From: Santa Ana, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: duck833

I go to Trader Joe's every once in awhile bottom feeding and have found that most wines there are not very good.  Out of three bottles I buy there I can maybe drink one and the other two go down the drain.


I gave up on TJ's, too.  Nearly everything I've tried from there stunk literally and figuratively.

And then there's these Hall of Infamer's:

Yellowtail, Turning Leaf, Meridien, Edna (Not Eden) Valley, Fetzer, Craneford, Franzia (2buck-chuck), Napa River, Santa Margherita, and I agree with the Ruffino condemnation, too.

(in reply to duck833)
Post #: 14
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 8:59:49 AM   
Paul S

 

Posts: 504
Joined: 1/15/2008
From: Singapore
Status: offline 		Ruffino just ain't no good. Anyone tried their top-end bottlings? More swill? Or is there some light in this rather dark tunnel of plonk?

(in reply to fingers)
Post #: 15
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 9:08:38 AM   
Maestro

 

Posts: 560
Joined: 10/4/2007
Status: online
quote:

ORIGINAL: Paul S

Ruffino just ain't no good. Anyone tried their top-end bottlings? More swill? Or is there some light in this rather dark tunnel of plonk?


Not really. No hope there. Don't get fooled by the marketing around the Ducale brand or the "Gold" labels. Utter plonk.

(in reply to Paul S)
Post #: 16
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 9:18:38 AM   
RoundersRob

 

Posts: 735
Joined: 7/1/2006
From: Santa Cruz, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Blue Shorts

Staying on the Santa Cruz theme, I nominate Beauregard Vineyards.  They have (had?) a tasting room on the municipal wharf.  My wife and I want there to taste the wine and left sorely disappointed. The wine wasn't total plonk unless you consider price.  Wine at that ($25 - $55) should be far better than that.

Ironically, I recently heard that the Bonny Doon tasting room is moving to Ingalls St in Santa Cruz and Beauregard is moving into the vacated Bonny Doon site.


Ugh - I didn't know that they were moving down there. 



(in reply to Blue Shorts)
Post #: 17
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 11:10:26 AM   
jhannah27

 

Posts: 523
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Anaheim, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Blue Shorts

Ironically, I recently heard that the Bonny Doon tasting room is moving to Ingalls St in Santa Cruz and Beauregard is moving into the vacated Bonny Doon site.


Are they taking over the room down on Bonny Doon Road?  That seems backward to me.

Oh, and another aside...I decided that if I ever started making my own wine I would call it Plonk.  I love that word.



_____________________________

"Quickly! Bring me a beaker of wine, so that I may wet my mind and say something clever."
Aristophanes 450 - 385 b.c.

(in reply to RoundersRob)
Post #: 18
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 12:26:38 PM   
Blue Shorts

 

Posts: 314
Joined: 2/5/2008
From: Santa Cruz, California
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jhannah27

quote:

ORIGINAL: Blue Shorts

Ironically, I recently heard that the Bonny Doon tasting room is moving to Ingalls St in Santa Cruz and Beauregard is moving into the vacated Bonny Doon site.


Are they taking over the room down on Bonny Doon Road?  That seems backward to me.

Oh, and another aside...I decided that if I ever started making my own wine I would call it Plonk.  I love that word.




That's my understanding.  I believe that my wife read about it in the Sentinel a few weeks ago... right after the fire up there.

_____________________________

The best wine is the one that you haven't yet tried.

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Post #: 19
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 1:58:01 PM   
Hollowine

 

Posts: 329
Joined: 7/25/2008
From: Hood River, OR
Status: offline 		I travel extensively all around the North America, and usually search out interesting wine retailers in the cities I visit so I have something to drink in the room in the eve's since it is too bloody hard to carry my own on the planes now. Had a 375 ml of Ruffino a few months ago, the nasty old $20 bill I paid with would have tasted better than it did. Plonk is right.

In Maui, on of my clients makes Pineapple wine, loaded me up with 4 bottles including the Pineapple-Passion Fruit flavor. Now to it's credit, it was still better than the Thunderbird I drank in High School, but not nearly as good as a Meridian Merlot (LOL) ...and I agree with the comments on Meridian, they serve that too often on airplanes, crap I thought these were the "Friendly Skies"?

Add to the Primadona Plonk List:

  • Anything in a box - People get so excited they can get a 1.5 L box for under $10 for their parties, I'd rather drink Nyquil

  • Beringer White Zinfandel - Unless you are single and are looking to inebriate and conquer a 20's something blonde at the company picnic, probably best left for refilling the hummingbird feeder.




On a semi-related side note, anyone ever snuck in bottles of your own juice to an event you know was going to only have Plonk?

Couple months back, brought a bottle of Northstar Merlot to my HS Reunion dinner since I knew all they were serving came out of a box. The caterer saw the bottle on the table and had security confiscate it...way to take me back to HS days, felt just like someone called a Narc on me.

(in reply to Blue Shorts)
Post #: 20
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 2:10:38 PM   
jhannah27

 

Posts: 523
Joined: 6/9/2008
From: Anaheim, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollowine
  • Beringer White Zinfandel - Unless you are single and are looking to inebriate and conquer a 20's something blonde at the company picnic, probably best left for refilling the hummingbird feeder.


I would like to add 80 year old women to those whom are OK to drink Beringer White Zin.

My brother's fiance will only drink White Zin and Boone's Farm (there's another name for our list)...and she's in her 30's!!  I have given them an ultimatum...She vows never to drink these "wines" again, or I stand up and object when the officiant asks if anyone feels this marriage should not take place. 

I can't be related, even if only by law, to someone who seeks these beverages out. 


_____________________________

"Quickly! Bring me a beaker of wine, so that I may wet my mind and say something clever."
Aristophanes 450 - 385 b.c.

(in reply to Hollowine)
Post #: 21
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 4:03:05 PM   
RoundersRob

 

Posts: 735
Joined: 7/1/2006
From: Santa Cruz, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollowine
  • Beringer White Zinfandel - .......probably best left for refilling the hummingbird feeder.


I wonder if this actually works?  Our hummingbirds are pretty fussy.


(in reply to Hollowine)
Post #: 22
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 8:17:27 PM   
Pavie Princess

 

Posts: 263
Joined: 5/19/2008
From: The Big Easy, New Orleans
Status: offline 		Silver Oak Alexander or Napa post 2003............the wine has become ordinary.

(in reply to RoundersRob)
Post #: 23
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 8:19:31 PM   
cgrimes

 

Posts: 906
Joined: 10/8/2007
From: Massachusetts
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Pavie Princess

Silver Oak Alexander or Napa post 2003............the wine has become ordinary.


...and every bit as expensive.  Do you feel the same about Opus One?
Craig

< Message edited by cgrimes -- 7/30/2008 8:20:18 PM >

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Post #: 24
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 9:43:18 PM   
Hollowine

 

Posts: 329
Joined: 7/25/2008
From: Hood River, OR
Status: offline 		I agree with the Silver Oak...we had a nice Vertical going since 1994, and I've decided to let our mailing list allocation lapse. QPR just sucks and I'd rather get two bottles of Lewelling or Saxum for the same price as one bottle of Silver Oak.

I haven't bought any Opus since I visited the winery in 1996 and scored two bottles of the 1994 for $90 each. Opened the first for Christmas Dinner last Dec, it was awesome and worth the wait! But I don't think it has been the same in the late 90's through present based on other comments I have seen, really just a trophy wine now. But I will say, if ever in Napa you need to go on the tour. They used to have two private tours per day and only one public one on weekends, I was able to get in on the private tours since my wife was a chef. Really an awesome facility, the best two wine empires could afford I guess...



(in reply to cgrimes)
Post #: 25
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/30/2008 10:03:25 PM   
Hollowine

 

Posts: 329
Joined: 7/25/2008
From: Hood River, OR
Status: offline 		Well, obviously Rob, you are dealing with the Hummingbirdius Bayareaus, identified by the brown and gold diamond pattern on its breast feathers that quite coincidentally resembles the Louis Vuitton trademark pattern. It is quite the fickle little beast that is a bit more concerned about maintaining appearances so as to not really take to the Beringer White Zin. You might want to try some of those pre-mixed Cosmopolitan cocktails, try diluting 50/50 with a nice bottle of Evian or Fiji bottled water.

Luckily up here in the PNW we have the more grounded Hummingbirdius Grungeisntdeadius, most commonly identified by their red and black flannel checkerboard colorings. The White Zin will work, but there is a general sense of apathy toward it most days before 2 pm. We have found better luck infusing the feeder with a 20% drip of Starbucks Pikes Place roast in the mornings, and playing Nirvana and Pearl Jam off of the deck speakers in the afternoons to attract the males.

(in reply to RoundersRob)
Post #: 26
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/31/2008 6:45:43 AM   
rbazinet

 

Posts: 188
Joined: 4/13/2008
From: Toronto, Ontario
Status: offline 		I am starting to agree with Pavie on Napa.  It seems I am constantly dishing out $50+ per bottle and getting a lot of disappointment in return.  I always thought these wines were made to drink with a rare steak, baked potato and some creamed spinach.  I will spin the wheel, again, this weekend!

(in reply to Hollowine)
Post #: 27
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/31/2008 8:20:56 AM   
pbm

 

Posts: 348
Joined: 3/5/2008
From: New Hope, Pennsylvania
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollowine

I would probably nominate most wines produced in states east of the Rocky Mountains. I know there are some exceptions such as northern New York for certain varietals, but there is a reason CA, OR and WA have the majority of shelf space in retail.


I can't speak for wines elsewhere east of the Rockies but having lived in Northern Virginia we were able to visit a lot of the wineries in that state and there are definitely some producers there making good juice. In particular, we like a 2005 meritage from Rappahannock Cellars. The description from the website: This is a blend of 32% Cabernet Sauvignon, 27% Cabernet Franc, 23% Merlot, 10% Malbec and 8% Petit Verdot. Big, rich, robust and dark; aromas of cedar, leather, back stone fruit, black cherries, cassis and vanilla, leading to a full palate structure with ?chewy? tannins, and a long, lingering finish.

One other observation, retail shelf space is determined by a lot of factors -- not just quality.

_____________________________

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"Never Sell Principle Short"
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Post #: 28
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/31/2008 8:55:30 AM   
fingers

 

Posts: 729
Joined: 8/26/2006
From: Santa Ana, CA
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: cgrimes

quote:

ORIGINAL: Pavie Princess

Silver Oak Alexander or Napa post 2003............the wine has become ordinary.


...and every bit as expensive.  Do you feel the same about Opus One?
Craig


I confess.  I have both Alexander Valley and Napa '03's that I bought when starting the cellar and have never tasted any SO.  I guess I'm not alone.  According to this CT report, it is the 4th most popular American wine in CT inventory.  Behind Phelps Insignia, Montelena Estate Cab, and Quilceda Creek.

http://www.cellartracker.com/list.asp?table=Pivot&Pivot1=Wine&iUserOverride=0&S1=qd

Actually, if you add the Alexander Valley and Napa together, it's #1
Anyone else buy into the hype like me?  I guess at one time, it must have been good and I'm told that lengthy cellaring will help.  At least, it's an impressive gift to someone that doesn't know any better!

< Message edited by fingers -- 7/31/2008 8:58:20 AM >

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Post #: 29
RE: "Hall of Infamy" - 7/31/2008 9:59:23 AM   
stevetimko

 

Posts: 115
Joined: 2/20/2007
Status: offline
quote:

ORIGINAL: jhannah27

I proudly nominate Bonny Doon Vineyards in Santa Cruz, Ca. 

My wife and I were given a 1 year gift membership in their wine club and with the exception of one wine (a dessert wine of all things), all were miserable dreck. And I think that of the 8 bottles we received, three were so bad that we dumped them out after the first glass or two.  To me, their popularity is merely due to genius marketing directed at the supermarket wine buyer who chooses based on who has the most interesting label.

You read anything ever written on the wine maker at Bonny Doon, and he is always raving about de-mystifying wine and bringing unique and little known varietals to the masses.  While I agree with the sentiment, making overly extracted and uncomplex versions of these varietals does nothing to promote thier uniqueness.  I say pick one or two and really work to do them well, rather than just plant every grape under the sun, hope it grows well in the region, and just try to blend it with every other grape imaginable to hide flaws. 

Bad form, if you ask me. 

Plus it's unfortunate that they are the most widely distributed wine from the Santa Cruz Mountains because there are several wineries making really fabulous wines down there.  Hopefully people aren't using Bonny Doon as a benchmark for the quality of the region as a whole.

As an aside...I have since decided that these friends of ours never actually liked us, and just came to the wedding for a free steak dinner and an open bar. 


Randall Grahm supposedly lost his focus when he tried to expand too quickly. As the wines gained popularity he couldn't get the good grapes in high enough quantity. People whose judgment I respect have tasted newer Boony Doon wines (I haven't) and they said the quality is returning.
But I agree, it was terrible wine for a long time. All marketing hype.


(in reply to jhannah27)
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