Crimes against wine. A rant. (Full Version)

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pjaines -> Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 4:11:36 AM)

For no particular reason, I am venting my spleen about some things that annoy me when eating out.

1.  I was having diner with a work colleague recently and he ordered a lovely white burgundy.  The wine was perfectly chilled so that it was not too cold and it was starting to release its flavours.  Unfortunately the geezer I was drinking it with insisted on ordering a big bucket of ice and sticking the bottle in the bucket.  "Its white wine - its meant to be bloody cold" the disgusting and uncultured oaf mumbled between fat, sweaty mouthfuls of food.

2.  DO NOT CONSTANTLY FILL MY GLASS UP.  PLEASE.  I cannot stand when the waiter keeps coming over to my table to keep topping up my white.  I like a little bit of wine in the glass so I can swirl it and smell it.  Dont fill the bloody glass all the way to the top so I can hardly pick the thing up without some spilling over the edge.

3.  Dont charge me an arm and a leg for a bottle of red wine then get angry when I send it back because it is as hot as a cup of coffee.  If you charge £50 for a bottle of wine look after it.  Dont stick it on a shelf in the window where it festers in the sun.

Rant over.



Maestro -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 5:20:49 AM)

Hear, hear.

Bring a handgun to the restaurant and threat lethal action against offenders. After a few casualties they may start learning...



pjaines -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 5:26:24 AM)

Possibly an extreme reaction but I'll see how it goes.



Serge Birbrair -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 6:07:58 AM)

Paul, good observations on all counts.
2. is easy for me, I don't let anybody touch my bottle after the bottle is open.
1. is not a problem either. Dinner table is NOT the place for Democracy. I loudly pronounce myself a wine expert due to my postings on CT board and
I take the reigns. I once sent to chill in the ice bucket the bottle of red somebody else brought, as the bottle was HOT for my red liking. I, somehow, neglected to ask the guy who brought the bottle if HE likes it this way. :)
3. Sometimes is a problem when wine is border line corked or has other flaws. I like to have the second opinion, usually my wife provides one.



Maestro -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 6:10:16 AM)

Another one my "favorite" situations is when I go out in a business dinner and some wannabe insists on having the wine menu instead of me.

After studying the wine carefully he then declares something like... "for the fish I will order a beautiful Liebfraumilch, which I know comes in a blue bottle in this place... really first class stuff. For the beef I am going to go with a nice Beaujolai Nouveau. It must be good, because they have the 2000 vintage here, so it should be really mature".

Last time it happened I lost it and told the offender I would simply not drink any of his choices. After the awkward silence, he handed over the wine list. A better time was had by all...



pjaines -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 6:32:28 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Serge Birbrair

. Dinner table is NOT the place for Democracy. I loudly pronounce myself a wine expert due to my postings on CT board and
I take the reigns.


Somehow Serge I thought it might be a dictatorship in your house.  I just got that feeling.



Serge Birbrair -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 7:23:20 AM)

Yes, it is and she does everything she wants!!!!

Maestro and me are "Wine Nazis" for sure, but...better us than "for the fish I will order a beautiful Liebfraumilch" them!
:)



Paul S -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 8:06:58 AM)

Another crime - perfectly good bottle of wine gets popped, wannabe wine expert with a palate shaped buy cheap, alchy plonk takes one sip, declares it spoilt because if does not taste like the stuff he normally has and gets the whole table in a tizzy of sniffing and swirling and making faces. Especially bad if the person is 1. a boss or 2. an important client - in both cases I grin and bear it.



Serge Birbrair -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 8:20:44 AM)

Paul, in your case you are the victim of the "gold rule"
-
whoever has the gold - makes the rules
:)



pjaines -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 8:21:07 AM)

I usually strategically position myself so that I am in charge of the wine list and initial tasting.  Especially if I think the person who wants to take charge is a wine chimp.




J2K -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 10:24:22 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Serge Birbrair

1. is not a problem either. Dinner table is NOT the place for Democracy. I loudly pronounce myself a wine expert due to my postings on CT board and I take the reigns.


I like that! Can you proclaim youself a "Master Cellar Tracker"??
Such as, "I will choose from the wine list as I am a Cellar Tracker Master"
Or "Considering my status as a Cellar Tracker Super Tracker, I will choose the wine"!
"No, we will not drink the wine you chose with the entree, I am a Cellar Tracker Forum Master and I assure you I can make a more suitable choice"

I also have been in the situation where a bottle was too warm. For some reason it embarrased the others at my table when I told the waiter it was too warm he should put it on ice. They even mentioned "wine snob"!
Of course, after it was chilled down the others conceded, "J2K you are a Cellar Tracker Master"!!



fingers -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 10:53:25 AM)

Funny that this comes up today because I'm going to dinner tonight with three friends that I've known for over 30 years.  One buddy drops off his dog with me this morning before he goes to work at the House of Mouse, and he produces two bottles from his car:  a 2003 Beringer Founder's Estate Merlot and an unkown Barossa that was marked down 16.99  to 10.99.  ACK!   Naturally, I will bring the wine I want from my cellar.  The "crime" here is how our friends like to think they're bringing an appropriate gift when they know nothing about it.  Guess where these bottles end up?  That's right, re-gifted!  Can't disown my friend - he gets me into Disneyland



mbannon -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 10:56:55 AM)

I'm widely regarded as the official wine geek in our office, so when the staff goes to dinner I am always handed the wine list.  I have full discretion...as long as I choose a California Chardonnay to start and a California Cabernet for the entree.  Any other suggestions generate shocked/puzzled looks and poo-poos all around.

-sigh-



jhannah27 -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 11:03:04 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: J2K

I also have been in the situation where a bottle was too warm. For some reason it embarrased the others at my table when I told the waiter it was too warm he should put it on ice. They even mentioned "wine snob"!
Of course, after it was chilled down the others conceded, "J2K you are a Cellar Tracker Master"!!


I feel your pain on the warm wine at restaurants.  I went to a restaurant not too long ago and when the waiter brought the bottle out and poured the wine, as pjaines put it best, was warm as coffee.  When I asked the guy where their wine was stored, he pointed to a rack above the bar, which just happened to be right next to the open kitchen! We had him bring us an ice bucket to chill it a bit so that we could even palate the wine.

I mean, come on!  I understand that not every restaurant is going to have a tempurature/humindity controlled wine cellar, but NOT storing the wine next to the flat top grill seems like a pretty obvious no brainer to me.

Oh, and I'm with Serge, either I pour myself, or I abruptly cut the server off just shy of the widest part of the glass to ensure that I can swirl and really get into the wine.

Another pet peeve of mine is when a restaurant that claims to have a respectable wine list uses the same glassware for every wine it pours, and it's always the same suffocating glass that never really lets the wine open.  This isnt' a huge deal for whites, because typically the glasses they use are only suitable for whites, but if I have ordered a red, get some bordeaux or burgundy glasses, let the damn thing breath! 

Again no brainer to me...make sure the wine shows at its best, and you will sell more.





nwinther -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 11:08:08 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Serge Birbrair
2. is easy for me, I don't let anybody touch my bottle after the bottle is open.


"Bottle" isn't some euphemism for anything disgusting, right Serge?[image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s2.gif[/image]



Serge Birbrair -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 11:13:06 AM)

of course not...I am VERY touchable in all other respects....well, maybe less than Max Mosley, though.
:) [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s8.gif[/image]



nwinther -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 11:46:25 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Serge Birbrair

of course not...I am VERY touchable in all other respects....well, maybe less than Max Mosley, though.
:) [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s8.gif[/image]


He he he.[image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s4.gif[/image]



smahk -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 12:30:41 PM)

I hate when they refill my glass.  Usually I like to swirl and let it open up - the last sip in my glass tastes diferent than the first.  Most servers are only to happy to have us take care of pouring the wine - one less task to remember.

And the glasses......ugh...wasn't that an entirely different thread that got beaten to death?  If they sell wine that they NEED to mark up 3x (and now it is >$100US) they could provide me with a decent glass - it doesn't even have to be riedel or crystal - just be appropriately shaped. 

Funy, but the best wine service in local small Mom & Pop restaurants is almost always the Italian Restaurants - even if they are just a little more than a pizzeria.  They seem to pride themselves on the ART of serving wine.



Serge Birbrair -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 12:47:20 PM)

I hate when after extensive study of overpriced wine list or mediocre wine list I opt for a Martini and snobby waiter asks:
"What wine would you like  with blah-blah-blah dish"?

My favorite response to look straight in his/her eyes, sip my Martini, and refuse due to me being a
Mormon
or
Alcoholic going to AA meetings after dinner.

I have a heavy Russian accent, and if the waiter doesn't believe his ears and asks me to repeat, I repeat and nod towards my wife and tell the waiter -
please don't tell this to my wife, she'd be very upset,
and all with the straight face and no smiles whatsoever.



rjonas -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 1:10:05 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: smahk


And the glasses......ugh...wasn't that an entirely different thread that got beaten to death?  If they sell wine that they NEED to mark up 3x (and now it is >$100US) they could provide me with a decent glass - it doesn't even have to be riedel or crystal - just be appropriately shaped. 



My crew and I were told once, on a cruise no less, that the wine we had ordered didn't warrant the "good" glassware; that was reserved for the better wines...  [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s2.gif[/image]  Mind you, we'd ordered an $80 bottle and we called the dining room manager over... For the remainder of the cruise, there was nice glassware on the table when we arrived for dinner... [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s1.gif[/image]



mbannon -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 2:18:07 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: rjonas


My crew and I were told once, on a cruise no less, that the wine we had ordered didn't warrant the "good" glassware; that was reserved for the better wines...  [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s2.gif[/image]  Mind you, we'd ordered an $80 bottle and we called the dining room manager over... For the remainder of the cruise, there was nice glassware on the table when we arrived for dinner... [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s1.gif[/image]

So that would be, what...a $20 bottle at the local supermarket?  Cheapskate.  The cruise waiter was right.  [image]http://www.cellartracker.com/forum/image/s4.gif[/image]



rjonas -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/24/2008 11:10:37 PM)

haha!  Actually, it was a token bottle as we'd brought our own wine...



pjaines -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/25/2008 12:30:42 AM)

Oh man, I forgot about the glasses.  I once went to a really good tapas restaurant in London, paid about £70 ($140) for a bottle of wine and they served it in what I could only describe as a whisky tumbler.  My English indignation erupted to such a point that I was almost moved to write a strongly worded letter. 

When I asked for a proper wine glass the waiter said they didn't have any other type of glass so I asked him to go to the restaurant next door and borrow two of their glasses.  The waiter looked like I'd stood up on a table and waved my tackle in the air in front of his grandmother.



Paul S -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/25/2008 12:39:20 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: Serge Birbrair

I hate when after extensive study of overpriced wine list or mediocre wine list I opt for a Martini and snobby waiter asks:
"What wine would you like  with blah-blah-blah dish"?

My favorite response to look straight in his/her eyes, sip my Martini, and refuse due to me being a
Mormon
or
Alcoholic going to AA meetings after dinner.

I have a heavy Russian accent, and if the waiter doesn't believe his ears and asks me to repeat, I repeat and nod towards my wife and tell the waiter -
please don't tell this to my wife, she'd be very upset,
and all with the straight face and no smiles whatsoever.


Now, that is hilarious. I HATE overpriced wine lists as well, especially if a place has exorbitant corkage. Pure evil that combination.

Like many of you, I have been deemed the official wine geek at office functions, that helps a bit - only problem is that many of my friends, associates and partners' wives and girlfriends now blame me for starting them on the bad habit of spending more and more on wine.

Fingers - I have one way to deal with the plonk people shower me with thinking that I would appreciate a "nice" bottle of wine as a gift - cook wine based dishes.



pjaines -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/25/2008 1:26:23 AM)

Gifts from family can indeed be a bit of a nightmare.  My old man has decided that at the age of 60 he has started to drink wine and subsequently to send me a case of wine at Christmas each year.  When I say wine, I actually mean red liquid with some alcohol in it.  He sent me one case of teeth enamel stripping, gut rotting booze.  When he next came to London to see me he asked where the wine was - I answered that it needed a few years to develop and that it was in the cellar aging.  It was infact in the stew we were eating.   



Serge Birbrair -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/25/2008 3:02:12 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pjaines

The waiter looked like I'd stood up on a table and waved my tackle in the air in front of his grandmother.


Say what you please, but I am very happy I can still learn English and make new discoveries.
Paul, good one!



rloomis -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/25/2008 9:32:37 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Maestro
After studying the wine carefully he then declares something like... "for the fish I will order a beautiful Liebfraumilch, which I know comes in a blue bottle in this place... really first class stuff. For the beef I am going to go with a nice Beaujolai Nouveau. It must be good, because they have the 2000 vintage here, so it should be really mature".


OMG that was funny! I´m so glad I read this in the morning so it was a mouthful of coffee that spilled over my desk instead the evening and a mouthful of red wine!



Maestro -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/25/2008 10:16:03 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: rloomis


quote:

ORIGINAL: Maestro
After studying the wine carefully he then declares something like... "for the fish I will order a beautiful Liebfraumilch, which I know comes in a blue bottle in this place... really first class stuff. For the beef I am going to go with a nice Beaujolai Nouveau. It must be good, because they have the 2000 vintage here, so it should be really mature".


OMG that was funny! I´m so glad I read this in the morning so it was a mouthful of coffee that spilled over my desk instead the evening and a mouthful of red wine!


Sorry about your coffee... [:D]



Wrighty -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/27/2008 8:48:19 AM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: pjaines

I usually strategically position myself so that I am in charge of the wine list and initial tasting.  Especially if I think the person who wants to take charge is a wine chimp.




Is this why you ordered the first wine last week?

HK seems to have got the glass thing sorted: not always Riedel but normally suitable.  I am also the default wine list reader at work dinners (unless there are very senior people present) which can be a little dis-spiriting when there are wine fans around who might know something I don't.  I normally feel obliged to go 'safe' as it has to suit all but is normally better than a bottle of the over priced 'house'.  I have managed to convince most of our regular visitors that riesling is good (esp. with Chinese food).  What's next though?

Wrighty



zippz -> RE: Crimes against wine. A rant. (7/27/2008 7:11:12 PM)

Interesting ... my first reaction to most of these posts for this thread was one of disbelief.
I thought you guys were joking. Some of you sounded a bit too pompous and petty.
But after considering some of my own pet peeves, i figured i wasn't any better.

What really gets under my skin, isn't so much of the lack of wine know-how,
but more of what takes place at the dinning table.

How about...
...well educated and groomed people eating with their mouths full?
...company who take every conversation topic and detour it back to something about themselves?
...parents who bring their kids along? Sure there may be exceptions to the rule,
but from what i have observed most kids can't sit still,
let alone sit quietly or contribute anything worthwhile to any discussion.
...or how about the loud and obnoxious party at the table next to you?



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