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Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 10:19:15 AM   
ChrisinCowiche

 

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I started to create a poll surrounding this topic, but couldn't decide what to list as choices; maybe if folks chime in a poll might make sense to further any discussion.

Anyway my thought/comment/questions are this...

How did your wine palate develope (your age, style of wines, varietals)?  Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now?  If so, how and how much?   How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer?  Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere? (Bryan's 40 year marriage to slippers had me thinking about this one. )  

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 10:41:53 AM   
Bryan Collins

 

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As I've been namechecked I'd better reply I guess!

I used to love exploring, and I still do to a certain extent, but I do feel that exploring, for me, is all about finding what you love best - once you've found it, buy more! Of course, you need to keep exploring if your tastes change - which mine have, at least a couple of times. I started off drinking Bordeaux and Australia, then I moved on to the southern Rhone and South America, and those are four "regions" I virtually never touch these days. Now, my big things are Burgundy, Piedmont, the northern Rhone and Germany, with relatively minor supporting roles from Champagne, Rioja, New Zealand and Tuscany.

My tastes do seem to be much more stable these days. I'm not sure why; perhaps in my early days I knew so little that random changes were much more likely to throw up something else I liked more, whereas now, while I'm not claiming to know a lot, I've got a lot more experience and have eliminated a lot of potential options - and I know that Bordeaux and Chateauneuf, say, along with "big" wines in general, or overly floral or borderline flabby whites such as gewurztraminer or viognier, are never going to be in my list of absolute favourites. Maybe it's like when you first realise you need glasses; my prescription changed quite a bit in the first five years and now it never changes at all.

The interesting question is: if the first wines I'd been exposed to had been those that I love most now, would the story have been different? Would I have moved on from those, perhaps to Claret and Condrieu, and would I now be extolling their virtues? I don't know. I don't think there are really any absolutes, and trying to understand why I like what I like isn't going to get me anywhere. I certainly do hope that my tastes don't change enormously any time soon and leave me with over five thousand bottles of stuff I'm not so keen on any more...

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 10:50:12 AM   
champagneinhand

 

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Started with Napa cabs and stayed there awhile, then moved towards Europe. I really got into Italy and have never really left, mainly Tuscany and the Piedmont. I then lived in WA like you do and started drinking the local stuff that seemed to improve massively from '96 through current times. I have always liked Bdx, and now I'm enjoying S. America, CA central coast and the wines of the Rhone. I tried to get into Burgs this last year....still working on that and German Riesling. I have always liked Tokaji and of course Champagne! I have had the good and the bad from Auz, but have very few these days.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 11:26:32 AM   
wineismylife

 

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How did your wine palate develop (your age, style of wines, varietals)?

I'm a little bit of a freak of nature in this regard. I actually started with Bordeaux and Burgundy. Then I migrated to California Cabernet and Chardonnay. Then I had a quick phase with Australia. Then I ditched Burgundy in favor of Oregon. Then I flirted with South America followed by South Africa. I've been pretty much full circle at this point digging all things French, Italian and Spanish these days. I definitely lean more towards Old World with plenty of age.

Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now?

See above. No doubt.

If so, how and how much?

See above. A lot!

How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

Once again, see above.

Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer? Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere?

I would say I'm a constant explorer. I'm always tasting wines new to me, new regions here and there, etc... I always seem to be on a quest for that next great wine at a great price. However, I also have a tendency to buy what I know. So I might be searching for the next great white from the Savoie while at the same time buying each vintage of my tried and true producers from the Loire.



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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 12:44:00 PM   
S1

 

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Started with Bordeaux in college and discovered Rieslings in Germany
Added Napa, abandoned Napa
Burgundy thunderbolt in 2000, Rhone in '01
Napa back in the fold in '07
Added Oregon PNs (Cristom) and Calif Syrah & PN
Now I almost exclusively buy Burg, S. France (Rhone to Roussillon), and Napa
am trying to add Washington and more Italian
About the only things I avoid are the really jammy oaky Aussies and Spanish
If I can convince HRH to buy another cooler after the princess graduates in June, I will fill it with German/Austrian/Alsatian

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 1:21:54 PM   
Ibetian

 

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I'va also explored a lot and still do a bit, but I've mostly stopped buying Cali cabs after having them start as the biggest position in my then-nascent cellar. Like many others, I used to drink a lot of Aussie, but rarely drink any now and have just 2 bottles in the cellar. I had a lot of Barolo at one point, but do not any longer. I've made an honest effort to get into Burgs and Spanish wines, but they just don't seem to quite hit the spot that Bordeaux does very consistently. So now it's mostly BDX with some BDX-style Cali blends like Insignia and Togni, supplemented by some Brunello. Might change again, but I doubt it. Well- aged Bordeaux is such a favorite of my wife and I, and I have so much BDX in the cellar I doubt we'll change much. I keep trying Burgs from time to time, and try more exotic choices, especially when traveling, but my wine journey has been a long way already. Although we might prefer different wines, like Bryan, I'm happy where I am now.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 1:51:09 PM   
ChrisinCowiche

 

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Thanks for all the responces.  I feel like a complete newbie and young all over again.

How did your wine palate develope (your age, style of wines, varietals)?  I really only dabbled in wine until about 4 years ago when we moved to Washington wine country.  Since then , my palate has been formed by local wines from Washington,  mostly the bigger denser red wines, and to a much lesser extent, Oregon, with some smattering of non-local wines sampled from time to time.  During our first trips to Willamette after a year of palate forming in WA, I was not impressed with those wines, and it took me several trips and lots of sampling to find OR Pinots that "fit" my palate.   I've really developed a love for WA Syrah, but always am at home with a Cab, Merlot, or Bordeaux style blend too.    I have always, even before WA, had an affinity for Sangiovese, and see that and other Italian wines as my next frontier to explore and learn.

Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now?  If so, how and how much?   How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?   See above, I don't know how or if my palate will "leave" Washington, but I know my palate has shifted to prefer certain producer styles over others.  Lighter is sometimes better, lighter on the oak, lighter on the extraction, but mostly better is better.   I've drank enough of the lower end stuff to know the difference.

Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer?  Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere?  Like others here this is a yes and a no.   I'm very satisfied with my current cellar make-up, 85% WA, but hope to explore other regions as time and money allows.   I really rely on my cohorts here to point me in the best direction when sampling and exploring areas unknown to me.   Eventually I'll take those steps on my own, but the greater wine world is pretty daunting to think about learning it all.

< Message edited by ChrisinSunnyside -- 2/20/2012 1:53:32 PM >


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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 1:57:07 PM   
powersaxo

 

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ChrisinSunnyside

I started to create a poll surrounding this topic, but couldn't decide what to list as choices; maybe if folks chime in a poll might make sense to further any discussion.

Anyway my thought/comment/questions are this...

How did your wine palate develope (your age, style of wines, varietals)?  Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now?  If so, how and how much?   How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer?  Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere? (Bryan's 40 year marriage to slippers had me thinking about this one. )  


Started with Napa cabs in my 20's and have stuck to new world stuff for the most part - west coast cabs and syrah, malbec from Argentina, and Shiraz. The last year or two (I'm now 33), I've been venturing into Bordeaux, Rhone and Italy (BdM and super Tuscans) but thus far have bought much more than I've tried.

My origins have definitely influenced where I am now. The Napa cabs I started off with were not as fruit forward as many others in Napa. Over the years I've ventured out into the more hedonistic styles and certainly enjoy those but have also started to wade my way into France and Italy.

I don't see myself as an explorer too much. I want to learn more about wine but have a slow pace, so I tend to be a bit more conservative as I don't want to waste the two or so times I open a bottle of wine each month.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 2:03:44 PM   
pjaines

 

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I have moved towards more terroir driven wines and away from New World wines. I actively sought out non-French wines for years (rebelling against my wife?) but over the last 18 months I more or less buy only French wines - mostly Loire, Burg, Northern Rhone and some weird and wacky stuff.

I think everyone starts with the more straightforward styles and work their way outwards. I used to buy almost always South African reds - now I can't stand them. Same with Bordeaux - I love the mature ones, but I'm bored with them.

I like what Bryan says, and we seem to have similar tastes these days - although I do love seeking out the unusual regions. Gaillac is a current favourite for me. I aim to have a staple diet of N Rhone, Piedmont, Burgundy of about 60% but try and mix it up with Soave, southern European whites and reds from places all over Europe. I am less inclined to try Chilea, US, Australian these days (with a couple of exceptions).

I still get a kick from discovering some Eastern European wine with an unpronounceable name.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 2:12:33 PM   
GalvezGuy

 

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How did your wine palate develop (your age, style of wines, varietals)?

Like WIML, I really started differently. Oregon Pinot was my first love, but Bordeaux was the first region that really sang to me, so much of my earlier efforts are rooted there. I still have a soft spot for Bordeaux. I then got on a high octane kick where there were a lot of Aussies and Spanish wines. That moved me to South America and then to California. Right now, I am really starting to "get" well aged whites and I am really on a kick of Cali Cabs from the 70's and 80's, Througout all of it, I have tried to open my mind to the fact that I should try anything from any where. I think there is a place and time for every type of wine, provided it has balance. However, if you looked at my cellar you would think that all I drink is Cali and Bordeaux.

Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now?

Absolutely, if you had served me an old Barolo 8 years ago, I certainly would not have liked it. Now, I drink it every chance I get. Same with older wines of just about any type. WIML absolutely ruined me with an old Barolo he served at oskiwawa's place.

If so, how and how much?

A boatload. My WOTY of the year last year was a 73 Sterling Reserve Cab. It was a profound and moving bottle. It has changed my buying habit from buying things to lay down to buying things that I can share and give back to others.

How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

It has changed and it has not. I still love a good new world pinot, I can love the Spanish bombs like Clio, but I appreciate so many more things now than I did then. I would say that I prefer balance and nuance over sheer power.

Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer? Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere?

I would say that I am always looking to diversify my palate. When the wallet allows, I am going to be accumulating more whites to lay down, especially Old Word whites as they just work so damn well with our local foods here.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 2:30:12 PM   
hankj

 

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How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

I've tried and grown fond of then somewhat tired of many different varietals and regions, but essentially my palate hasn't changed since I started tasting good wine 25 years ago via work in fine dining. I don't know why it hasn't changed. For instance from the get-go I thought Far Niente Chardonnay was very good and still do. Same with Trefenthen Cab. But cloying wines, fake tasting wines, and obnoxiously funky or "charmingly flawed" whites I still don't go for. And I've always disliked reductive Syrah and still do, no matter what the reputation.

If there has been a change it's been away from middle of the road bottles (Beringer Alluvium for instance). This is not so much a change in palate as a change in attitude -- I'd rather drink one excellent $50 bottle of wine and a "fun" $10 bottle than two $30 pretenders.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 3:41:00 PM   
BobMilton

 

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I started with champagne in my teens (loved the stuff, when I could get away with it!). Went to California Cabs/Merlots in my early twenties, then dabbled in Bordeaux in my mid twenties. (Not to give away my age, but Lafite was less than $20 a bottle - and, no I did not leave out any zeros!). Was never wowed by a wine until 30 years ago when my current wife and I had a bottle of Heitz Bella Oaks. That started my study of California wines, and I'm still at it. Have only sampled about 15% of the state's producers and would like to more than double that. By then, I'll be too old to tell the difference, and can live out my final years drinking $2 Chuck!

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/20/2012 9:48:27 PM   
forecaster

 

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Despite growing up with wine in the house, it wasn't until 2007 when I was in my mid 20s that I had my first transformative wine experience. It was a work dinner, and the wine was a Martinborough pinot noir (https://www.cellartracker.com/new/wine.asp?iWine=899989). For the next few years I continued trying pinot, mixed in with some cheaper Aussie Shiraz.

A trip to Hawkes Bay in 2009 started to get me interested in Syrah much more - the wines were so much more elegant and interesting than the jammy Aussie shiraz that I had been drinking. These wines are still a favourite of mine.

It wasn't until early last year that I really started to explore wine outside of my own backyard. I discovered a local wine merchant with a penchant for somewhat obscure wines from around the world. I became friendly with the proprietor - a 30+ year veteran of the industry - and he helped lead me in my exploration. I would say that up until that point I had an interest in wine - now it is a passion.

Since then about 2/3rds of my consumption has been non-NZ, with a heavy leaning toward Languedoc, Portugal, Spain and Italy. There have also been some forays into more exotic territories such as Greece and Morocco. And my current cellar, while small at only 90 bottles, contains wines of 20 different varieties from 6 countries.

Sadly, after 28 years in the business that merchant is closing down on Saturday.

I am still in the early days of my wine exploring, and I am far from settling for a favourite region or variety. I still love syrah, and plan to focus on rhone versions over the next year or two. I also love the white wines of Alsace. Where to from here? I don't know, but I'm sure I'm going to enjoy the ride.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/21/2012 4:51:32 AM   
grafstrb

 

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Before I get into my answers, it likely bears mentioning that I've been "into" fine wine for only about 8 years now. So, please consider that context while reading the following responses.

quote:


How did your wine palate develope (your age, style of wines, varietals)?

In the beginning: preferred big wines, and a strong oak presence didn't bother me (I actually liked it). Drank lots of Aussie Shiraz because it was "good" and was "high scoring." I also found Cotes du Rhones to my liking rather early on. Drank mostly reds. Not too terribly concerned about wine-food pairings.
Now: Still like big wines, but do not necessarily prefer them --- I've come to realize that my favorite wines are "big" wines that have a lot of age on them (thereby sculpting much of their "bigness" into something somewhat more beautiful and elegant than they were in their youth; so, I still like my CdP, but I want it with age. I love CA Cab., but only if it has at least 10 years on it. Oak that's more than "somewhat noticeable" usually bothers me. I try to avoid "big, gloppy, structure-less" wines, and instead try to focus on wines with structure and greater acidity. About half the wines I drink now are whites, and I wouldn't be surprised to find myself drinking maybe 60% whites a few years down the road. Wine-food pairings now very important to me --- food usually dictates which wine I will choose for the evening (hence the significant increase in white wine consumption -- although, my discovery of German Riesling a few years ago has a lot to do with that, as well.)


quote:

  Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now? 

To the extent that "palate development" is the same as "changing preferences", then I think this question is merely a restatement of the question above.  (see above)


quote:

If so, how and how much?

I don't see how it couldn't. So, "yes", and "a lot."


quote:

  How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

(see above re: "How?"). As for "why?": I don't know. It just has. I think it's natural for one's preferences to change over time. I suppose it mostly has to do with being exposed to things I was previously not exposed to. For example, I only recently discovered sherry. Surely, I would have enjoyed it had I been introduced to it in the same way many years ago, but that introduction simply happened when it happened. I didn't *not* like sherry 3 or 4 years ago; rather, 3 or 4 years ago, I merely *did not know* that I like sherry.

I will say, however, that my preferences seem to have shifted away from the "international" style over the years --- you know, the style where, if you were tasting blind, you would have no idea what it is because it could be any one of numerous different wines because it's made in the uber-ripe, soft, round, oaky style --- that style irritates/bores me, and I try to avoid those wines in favor of wines that bring something unique and/or interesting to the glass.


quote:

Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer?  Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere?

Constant explorer. It's in my DNA, and there's nothing I can do about it. Sure, I have a few pet producers whose wines I have (relatively) a lot of, but I enjoy the journey -- often more than the destination -- so I don't see myself ever losing interest in "looking elsewhere." That said, ya never know, do ya?!?


< Message edited by grafstrb -- 2/21/2012 4:53:28 AM >


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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/21/2012 6:00:07 AM   
Paul S

 

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Not sure if this answers the question, but here is how my palate has wondered (in short form):

Started with Aussie Shiraz and NZ Sauvignon Blanc
Moved on to Burgundy (reds) and Bordeaux (reds)
Expanded to include Burgundy Whites and Chianti
Fell in love with German Rieslings and CdPs
Took in Barolo and Babaresco
Seriously got hooked on Champagnes
More recently been exploring a lot more old Rioja and Ribera
The Loire and Northern Rhone has probably the latest stop
Port, Tokaji and Sauternes fits in there somewhere too

Favourite still and probably always will be red Burgs, but a whole lot of the others are not too far behind.

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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/21/2012 7:05:55 AM   
fingers

 

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Does this answer the question?

2006 - avg btl cost - 12.39
2007 - - 21.37
2008 - - 27.13
2009 - - 30.60
2010 - - 31.61
2011 - - 33.71



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RE: Palate Preferences and Development? - 2/21/2012 12:05:49 PM   
recotte

 

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How did your wine palate develop (your age, style of wines, varietals)?

I started getting into wine at the age of 22 and quickly gravitated to Napa & Sonoma Cab, Vintage Port, and a wide variety of Italian reds. I give the credit for the latter to a slightly eclectic shop here in West LA--the Wine Expo. I've mentioned elsewhere in the last week that I have a soft spot for Sagrantino di Montefalco. Barolo, Brunello, Chianti, Barbaresco, Amarone... yes, I loved--and still love--them all.

For historical reasons that may be suited more for a "Whole Bottle Consumed Alone" catharsis, my wine life was put on hold around 2004 or so, with my regional preferences where they were, but a bit more fully explored.

Only in 2010 did the wine fever reassert itself. However, I found that Cali Cabs had lost a bit of their luster, and I really started hitting Central Coast Rhone varietals hard (by my standards, at least). 2011 saw me extend out to Bordeaux, Northern and Southern Rhone, and Washington State. I would be lying if I said that my exploration wasn't heavily influenced by a lot of the folks here.

2012 rolls around, and I have hungry eyes set on more CdP, Spain, and, yes, an intentional foray into Burgundy, while continuing to build on the areas from 2011.


Do you think that development has an influence on which wines you prefer now?

I think the time I spent "away" from wine was a huge reset button for me.


If so, how and how much?

Huge. See above.


How has your palate changed over time and why (if you know or care to guess)?

Absolutely. See above.


Somewhat related, do you see yourself as a constant explorer for the next best/favorite wine grape/region/producer? Or are you satisfied with what you like/have/buy and not interested in looking elsewhere?

I am a constant explorer while continuing to build depth in the areas I know I like.


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