RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ?

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RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/15/2013 6:48:10 PM

copdyke

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Could one not use this to drink 3/4 bottle of an amazing vintage wine and refill it with an ok vintage? I understand the capsule may be disturbed but this seems like it could possibly be used for negative purposes. Maybe if I would have an actual hands on demo with one I would understand better.

(in reply to Beachrooster)

Post #: 31

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/15/2013 7:28:33 PM

ob2s

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I am 99% sure you could not hack it to do that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: copdyke

Could one not use this to drink 3/4 bottle of an amazing vintage wine and refill it with an ok vintage? I understand the capsule may be disturbed but this seems like it could possibly be used for negative purposes. Maybe if I would have an actual hands on demo with one I would understand better.

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Post #: 32

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/15/2013 7:44:39 PM

champagneinhand

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quote:

ORIGINAL: ob2s

I am 99% sure you could not hack it to do that.

quote:

ORIGINAL: copdyke

Could one not use this to drink 3/4 bottle of an amazing vintage wine and refill it with an ok vintage? I understand the capsule may be disturbed but this seems like it could possibly be used for negative purposes. Maybe if I would have an actual hands on demo with one I would understand better.

you would need a second needle ad replacing while pulling would be the tricky thing, but its do-able. reverse the polarity of the 2nd machine, and have some kind of pumping set up powered by a piston propelled by the argon from the other unit to match said volume.

Again, remote, but bored, creative minds have recreated plates of currency by hand etching metal. That's pretty amazing in and besides itself. Probably much easier lifting the label and capsule to another bottle. But the cork is the tricky part of the job.

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Post #: 33

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/15/2013 9:50:08 PM

budh

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I got mine this week. Since my wife doesn't drink wine (migraines), this is a potential life changer for me in several ways:
1. Get to try something different every night, rather than being committed to finishing off a bottle over three nights.
2. Food/wine pairing will be much easier; I won't hesitate to have a nice Cab with the occasional steak since I don't have to worry about finishing the cab with some not so cab-friendly meals later.
3. Makes it easy to check out drinkability in cases where there is conflicting (or no) info about when to drink.
4. Makes it easy to do verticals, horizontals, whatever, without needing a crowd of people to join in.
5. Makes it easier to drink an expensive wine alone without feeling quite so guilty (after all, I'm only drinking 1/3 of it...)
6. Accelerates the learning curve when trying a new region, producer, etc. when you can have a little of several different wines at once.

Here's hoping it works as advertised!

I know many of you don't have the same problems with unfinished wine or drinking alone. As they say, I'd rather drink alone than not at all....

(in reply to dream)

Post #: 34

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 4:44:14 AM

Jhcwine

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i'm in the same position as Budh. So I'd really love this to work.

I just do not understand one thing. My local retailer (LCBO) has an argon wine bar. The wine bottles are opened and re-stoppered and any wine removed is replaced with argon under some degree of pressure. Yet these wines change and eventually die over the course of a couple of weeks. I have had many disappointing tastings of wines that were on their way out from that bar. And I've read that these argon bars are meant for the short term preservation of wine. Both this system and the Coravin apparently cover the wine with argon. So how /why is Coravin different? Why does it work and a standard argon bar not? I must be missing something here. Can anyone shed some light on my darkness?

I'd love this to work, but am quite nervous about it.

Thanks

Jhcolman

(in reply to budh)

Post #: 35

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 5:47:38 AM

fingers

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Since the wine bar machines dispense in small tastes, perhaps the number uses means that a little unwanted air creeps in also?

Just a theory

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Post #: 36

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 10:11:33 AM

MindMuse

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quote:

ORIGINAL: jhcolman

i'm in the same position as Budh. So I'd really love this to work.

I just do not understand one thing. My local retailer (LCBO) has an argon wine bar. The wine bottles are opened and re-stoppered and any wine removed is replaced with argon under some degree of pressure. Yet these wines change and eventually die over the course of a couple of weeks. I have had many disappointing tastings of wines that were on their way out from that bar. And I've read that these argon bars are meant for the short term preservation of wine. Both this system and the Coravin apparently cover the wine with argon. So how /why is Coravin different? Why does it work and a standard argon bar not? I must be missing something here. Can anyone shed some light on my darkness?

This is the key difference. Once a bottle is opened the bad Genie is in the bottle for good. The wine is exposed to oxygen, and even if argon or some other mix of inert gases are squirted in, you're still going to trigger some level of interaction with the O2. Plus, the popular notion that the heavier inert gases "blanket" the wine and keep the oxygen layered above an inert layer apparently just is not true. The gases do mix and balance out a concentration and oxygen will still interact with the wine, though in lesser concentration than if the inert gas was not also present. One would assume that the more effectively you can evacuate air when replacing with inert gas the better effect. I think this is why Private Reserve gives some fairly specific instructions on shooting in their gas. The Coravin presumably does not ever allow that ingress of oxygen, though I suspect that some bit of oxygen, residual in the needle cannula e.g., may well make its way in.

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Post #: 37

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 10:31:07 AM

ob2s

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If you wanted to use coravin to remove the wine and then put diff wine back in, you'd simply use the coravin as described and then this for a refill, though this syringe costs more than the coravin. And an empty needle to release the argon displaced.

< Message edited by ob2s -- 1/2/2018 3:40:30 PM >

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Post #: 38

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 11:08:40 AM

Blue Shorts

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One assumes that those with bottles worth thousands of dollars don't fret about opening them. They can afford them, for the most part.

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Post #: 39

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 11:14:26 AM

Jasonrgreen

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I am coining a new tasting note term. SnP (Stuck and Poured)

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Post #: 40

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 11:50:22 AM

MindMuse

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Jasonrgreen

I am coining a new tasting note term. SnP (Stuck and Poured)

My first tasting note using this device begins:

"CnP (Coravin-ed and Poured)."

_____________________________

... she uncorked it and put it to her lips. "I know something interesting is sure to happen," she said to herself, "whenever I eat or drink anything; so I'll just see what this bottle does."
- Alice's Adventures in Wonderland

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Post #: 41

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 12:59:05 PM

SkeBum

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I doubt that I will get one of these things, but it brings up a lot of interesting issues: Secondary market for example, how is one to know that someone didn't just Coravin a little out the bottle decided that they didn't like it and are now selling it. Or in the example of a great bottle, refill it somehow, and where there is a will there is a way.

Could lead to expensive mistakes also, oh I just want to try a little of this '82 Cheval Blanc and when the needle gets half way down into the cork, the bottom half of the cork lets loose. Oops...

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Post #: 42

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 8:23:51 PM

budh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: SkeBum

Could lead to expensive mistakes also, oh I just want to try a little of this '82 Cheval Blanc and when the needle gets half way down into the cork, the bottom half of the cork lets loose. Oops...

I suppose that is possible, but I've been truly amazed at how easily the needle slides through the cork. It is quite sharp and small. If it would make a cork disintegrate, then even an ah-so opener would likely do the same.

(in reply to SkeBum)

Post #: 43

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/16/2013 8:31:43 PM

budh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Eric

quote:

ORIGINAL: budh

Count me among the"CT suckers" who have ordered one. I guess this means that Eric needs to revamp the whole CT site to account for partial bottles! Instead of drinking a bottle, we'll want to record that we drank 1/5 of a bottle and 4/5 remains....

Add/edit the per bottle private note. Thanks. No new features required.

Eric,
This will work fine for a while. And I certainly don't expect you to do anything major to accommodate a few of us. But eventually I can foresee really wanting the ability to see a list of my "stabbed" wines for purposes of selecting what to drink next. Can you sort the "my cellar" view to show wines with private notes only? I see the ability to generate a report showing private notes, but I have used that for other purposes, so it includes lots of notes on wines that aren't in my cellar.
thanks
Bud

< Message edited by budh -- 8/16/2013 8:37:05 PM >

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Post #: 44

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/17/2013 9:49:31 AM

ob2s

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Say you have location like Cellar:Bin B, so you can stab a bottle there and place it in a new bin Cellar:Bin Bs, you should be able to sort and find bottles as easy as before.

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Post #: 45

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/17/2013 10:29:09 AM

Eric

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You an EASILY run a filtered report on your INDIVIDUAL BOTTLES with "coravin" as all or part of bottle note. Save it on your saved search menu, and then you are always 1-click away from your Coravin'ed bottles.

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Post #: 46

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/17/2013 12:13:42 PM

Jasonrgreen

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Was at The Herbfarm last night for dinner. They have been testing the Coravin out. Serving 2001 d'Yquem by the glass.

(in reply to Eric)

Post #: 47

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/18/2013 12:50:32 AM

geppetto

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I coravin'ed a 2004 Errazuriz Viñedo Chadwick this evening. Very cool, but I am finding that I need more than the recommended 2 seconds of gas to get a reasonable pour. This makes me wonder if I will get 15 glasses out of a canister. So far I have two glasses from the current cannister. I will keep you posted on the number of glasses I get from the first canister.

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Post #: 48

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/18/2013 5:02:36 PM

budh

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quote:

ORIGINAL: Eric

You an EASILY run a filtered report on your INDIVIDUAL BOTTLES with "coravin" as all or part of bottle note. Save it on your saved search menu, and then you are always 1-click away from your Coravin'ed bottles.

Perfect! Thanks!

(in reply to Eric)

Post #: 49

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/19/2013 3:00:11 PM

randy082054

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If anyone's interested, I interviewed Coravin inventor Greg Lambrecht on my blog today.

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RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/25/2013 8:15:50 PM

dbg

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I'm not sure how much i really need this thing or how often i'll use it, but i had to have one to satisfy my gadgetphilia. Works like a charm. Second "pour" of a Bryant Cab a week after the first is indistinguishable, at least by memory. But...

(Warning, you may not want to try this at home)

I proudly demonstrate my shiny new toy for my wife, who says, "That's really unappealing. The nice sound and look of the wine pouring into the glass is gone. It's so slow, like an old guy having trouble peeing."

Shrinkage, anyone?

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Post #: 51

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 8/25/2013 9:00:47 PM

budh

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Very true! That's why it's ideal for those of us who must drink alone. I can get by without the romance of an elegant pour.... I can't imagine a restaurant doing this at your table! I had one bottle that I apparently was overzealous with the argon pump, and wine came misting out from around the needle, making a bit of a mess. Maybe a bad cork - I haven't gone back to that bottle yet to see how it is faring. But the other six stabs have gone perfectly.

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Post #: 52

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/2/2013 4:43:10 PM

wine247365

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Geppetto, how's the first cansister holding up?

Coravin getting a mention by the wine person at Fox...
http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2013/08/30/wine-gadgets-that-work/?intcmp=features

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Post #: 53

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/2/2013 5:55:07 PM

budh

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I'm at seven stabs so far - all on different bottles. It does take me at least 3 or 4 hits of gas to get the first glass poured from a bottle. I'm guessing that is because there is so little ullage to start with that the amount of argon going in is small with the first few blasts. Each successive blast seems to lead to a longer pour. Similar to pumping a weed sprayer - when it's full, it only takes a few pumps to pressurize, but you have to re-pump more often because the amount of pressurized air is less than it is later on.

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Post #: 54

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/2/2013 10:12:59 PM

geppetto

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quote:

ORIGINAL: wine247365

Geppetto, how's the first cansister holding up?

Coravin getting a mention by the wine person at Fox...
http://www.foxnews.com/leisure/2013/08/30/wine-gadgets-that-work/?intcmp=features

Still have only used it twice and now I am on a no drinking binge for 6 weeks. I won't be able to provide an update any time soon...

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Post #: 55

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/5/2013 7:38:36 AM

FRM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: budh

I'm at seven stabs so far - all on different bottles. It does take me at least 3 or 4 hits of gas to get the first glass poured from a bottle. I'm guessing that is because there is so little ullage to start with that the amount of argon going in is small with the first few blasts. Each successive blast seems to lead to a longer pour. Similar to pumping a weed sprayer - when it's full, it only takes a few pumps to pressurize, but you have to re-pump more often because the amount of pressurized air is less than it is later on.

I'm finding the same thing with the first pressurization. I worked my way through a 2004 Kistler and am about halfway through a 2005 Araujo Eisle, so far so good and still on the first canister.

(in reply to budh)

Post #: 56

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/14/2013 7:15:35 PM

budh

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My first canister expired after nine pours, almost all of them being the first shot from each bottle, averaging about 6 oz ea., over a one month period. So, about 70% of the promised three bottles. I'm thinking they are following the razor and razor blade model (but for the fact they are not exactly giving away the razor...). Oh well, it's still a game-changer for me. I love it. My only repeat stab was 25 days after the first one. No noticeable difference in the wine, but the proof will obviously come with a much longer period between stabs.

(in reply to FRM)

Post #: 57

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/15/2013 6:30:28 AM

FRM

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quote:

ORIGINAL: budh

My first canister expired after nine pours. . . . Oh well, it's still a game-changer for me. I love it.

I'm in the same camp with you on this one. I got a shade more than 2 bottles out of it (died in the middle of first pour of 3rd bottle). Fortunately, I got the free 3 extra canisters with the first order. No noticeable changes in the wine. I'm on a Scarecrow M. Etain (2009) now, after an '04 Kistler PN Cuvee Elizabeth and an '05 Araujo Eisle Cab. Definite game changer!!!

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Post #: 58

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/15/2013 8:55:15 AM

grizzlymarmot

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Some argon will dissolve into your wine. The solubility constant for argon is about 60 mg/L and that is at 1 atm pressure. So you are not just filling the empty space in the bottle. Especially on the first pour. By my calculations there are about 230 mg of Argon in 5 oz (at room temp and sea level). So the 40 mg or so that goes into the wine may not be trivial. Other argon facts, it is a bit heavier than air (39g/mole vs 29 g/mole). But due to diffusivity, it will completely mix with the other gases in air, so there is no 'blanket' effect. Once the wine (with the argon in it) gets into the normal atmosphere, the argon will quickly come out of solution - although not accompanied by fanfare like carbon dioxide when it is released from champagne.

< Message edited by grizzlymarmot -- 9/15/2013 11:40:22 AM >

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Post #: 59

RE: Coravin - Does it Truly Work ? - 9/15/2013 12:39:49 PM

budh

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Thanks for the info. So you are suggesting that first stabs will use more argon than later ones because of the volume of wine in the bottle, correct? I'll try to keep track to see how my usage goes.... New canisters cost about $12 each including the shipping (when buying a six pack). I wonder how long it will be before someone offers generic versions of these, just like printer ink, etc. I know they caution against using anyone else's canisters, but I imagine someone will eventually give them some workable competition.

(in reply to grizzlymarmot)

Post #: 60