Decanting and a really stupid question (Full Version)

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Eduardo787 -> Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 5:54:22 AM)

Try not to laugh about my question but, if we are trying to decant a wine to make it taste better because of its reaction with oxygen and we do it passively in a decanter for many hours with the surface or the wine having direct contact with the air why don´t we use a blender ? Yeah yeah, I know I am going to be nomiated for the weirdest question and maybe the most stupid as well, but some people splash decant a wine and to me that is the same principle as using a blender, inject the most air posible and make reations happen. So, why not use a NUtribullit or a blender, pour the wine, turn the machine on for a few seconds and drink the wine ? For SURE I am missing something here but it does sound logical to me although not elegant in any ways [:D]



cigar52 -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:04:25 AM)

Interesting question. I would believe as vibration to wine is harmful. Just as wine shipped across the US needs to rest for sometime before consumption.



ROEL -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:12:19 AM)

Have you ever heard of the Mollydooker Shake?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=21mMiJOOeZ8

I know from previous threads that there are some members who experimented with a blender for wine aeration (KPB for one), with mixed results.
Depends on the wine I guess.



Sourdough -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:13:18 AM)

This is similar to see easoning food. A bit of salt makes your food taste better but a cup of salt would ruin the effect. Adding a bit of oxygen acts in multiple ways. Over oxygenation will make much larger impacts and oxidize things that you don't want (extensively) oxidized. There are other effects beyond oxygenation as vokatilrs/aromatics are liberated from the wine.

But why not just perform a test on your own. Take a favorite bottle and gently decant into a carafe and give it maybe half an hour. Then pour half of that into a blender or a shaker and blend or shake vigorously for say 30 seconds. Pour a pair of glasses and compare.

I will suggest in advance that you will find that the adsorption of oxygen need not be very great before it us too much.



pbilling -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:15:37 AM)

I've seen a freshly opened bottle vigorously shaken in a tasting room at a respected winery in Napa. It was tasted before and after by my wife, the staff member and myself. There was a notable difference to the better. We were the only people in the place at the time. The staff member said they do it often but NEVER in front of the customers. Made us think.



forceberry -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:15:49 AM)

I know several people who have employed blender in aereating their wines to varying degrees of success.

The biggest problem is that in decanter the oxidation happens in a slow, controlled manner, whereas vigorous blender-aeration does the same thing a thousand times faster in a continuous manner. You really if you blend the wine for 2 seconds, it might be just enough but blending it for 5 seconds might be overkill.

The way how this happens is that in a decanter you want to let the nonaromatic volatile compounds evaporate first, so that the aromatic volatile compounds come to the fore after awhile. This process happens slowly and mainly from the relatively thin portion next to the wine-air surface. As the aromatic volatile compounds gain prominence, the wine "opens up", so to say. However, in a blender you don't have the wine-air surface just at the surface of the wine, but throughout the the wine, expanding the oxidizing surface of the wine by several magnitudes. This way both all the non-aromatic and aromatic compounds can become volatile almost at the same time and while the wine might open up in an almost instant, it might lose much of its aromatic qualities as well in a big puff.



MCrawford -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:21:00 AM)

Interesting thought. I would think you'd have frothy wine if you whipped it up in a blender, but maybe a scientific test is in order. Take two identical bottles, open and decant one bottle... wait an hour and pour the first glass. Open the second bottle and pour into the blender or Nutri-bullet... blend for a few seconds and let settle, then pour a glass and taste the two side by side. See if there's a difference. In all honesty, after I decant a wine, and know I'm letting it "open" for an hour or so, I am always walking by the decanter and giving it a good swirl, just to keep the air and wine moving.



davo22 -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:47:35 AM)

This is a method called hyper decanting. Wine is bottled to slow down the chemistry process and allow everything that went into that bottle time to come together and gel (with only a thimble size amount of oxygen involved in the experiment). From a pure chemistry perspective hyper decanting is kind of like throwing gasoline on an ember. So while I haven't personally tried hyper decanting, what I have read is that if you are not a fan of tannins, or a wine is extremely tannic, it can be a way to smooth them right out (or even eliminate them). But what I've also read is that it can be pretty detrimental to the nose on a wine and make a wine smell pretty bland. Nothing stopping you from giving various forms of decanting a try. Open a bottle, pour some directly into a glass, some in a decanter, some through an aerator, and some in a blender and taste/smell for yourself what the differences are.

Like one other post said, I have heard that some wineries use various methods of hyper decanting in their tasting rooms so they can actually sell their newer vintages (that most would just find too green out of the bottle to enjoy). Sadly a lot of people will take those home and open them to profound disappointment and head scratching.



wineismylife -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 7:54:07 AM)

smh



Hollowine -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 8:27:20 AM)

Ch Pavie and Bryers Vanilla Bean Ice Cream. Just sayin'...[8D]



Eddie -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 10:05:16 AM)

Arianna Occhipinti is known for using a blender to aerate her wines at tastings at her winery.



Wine Grove -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 10:27:26 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: pbilling

I've seen a freshly opened bottle vigorously shaken in a tasting room at a respected winery in Napa. It was tasted before and after by my wife, the staff member and myself. There was a notable difference to the better. We were the only people in the place at the time. The staff member said they do it often but NEVER in front of the customers. Made us think.


THIS Is really interesting...I'm sure it is somewhat commonplace if they said they did it often. Pbilling...would you share the winery? That would not prevent me from buying wine there (if it's one I like), I'M just curious.



thesternowl -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 10:46:34 AM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Eddie

Arianna Occhipinti is known for using a blender to aerate her wines at tastings at her winery.

quote:

Arianna Occhipinti is known for using a blender to aerate her wines at tastings at her winery.


Wow...I would not have expected that especially considering her approach towards winemaking.



Eduardo787 -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 10:46:41 AM)

It seems my question was not so dumb after all ! The Mollydooker shake I do it as well as swirl very heavily the decanter from time to time. I read from your responses that I do not enjoy tannic wines and that is quite the opposite, I like powerful tannic monsters, what I don´t like is acid and barn poop ( think very old style BDX and Riojas.....and yes, my quest with Italian wines as well )

I will do the experiment with some wines that are not that expensive and see the results. Maybe a CS substance cab in the blender for a few seconds and another one in the decanter for an hour and compare. Chateau Pavie with vanilla is a no-go for me but I will put some chocolate chips and hemp ( the one without THC!)




Blue Shorts -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 11:01:00 AM)

If it's an inexpensive wine, give it a shot. Basically, it is just oxidizing the wine far more quickly than usual.

Using devices such as a Vinturi does a similar thing, but without as much "brute force" as a blender. In any case, using a blender, Vinturi, or decanter is never a substitute for proper aging.



S1 -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 2:57:31 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: wineismylife

smh

tntpmp[;)]
(Trying not to pee my pants)



penguinoid -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:32:27 PM)

I am not sure how good a blender would be for decanting, but if you're going to try I would make the suggestion that you should ensure the blender is really, really clean, and doesn't have food or detergent residues in it. My (admittedly limited) experience with blenders is that they're difficult to clean, and there can be food residues lurking in unexpected places. This could obviously influence the flavour of the wine in unexpected and undesirable ways.



CranBurgundy -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 6:50:51 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollowine

PX and Bryers Vanilla Bean Ice Cream. Just sayin'...[8D]


FIFY.



jmcmchi -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 7:08:25 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: penguinoid

I am not sure how good a blender would be for decanting, but if you're going to try I would make the suggestion that you should ensure the blender is really, really clean, and doesn't have food or detergent residues in it. My (admittedly limited) experience with blenders is that they're difficult to clean, and there can be food residues lurking in unexpected places. This could obviously influence the flavour of the wine in unexpected and undesirable ways.


Sounds just like a destemmer [:)]



mye -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 7:17:05 PM)

A low and slow setting on a blender maybe? but at high speed, i think the heat generated is too much for the wine..



Hollowine -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 7:29:15 PM)

Eduardo...On a serious note, maybe get a Venturi instead of the blender. I hardly ever use mine anymore, but it did a great aeration into the decanter.



jmcmchi -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 8:38:12 PM)


quote:

ORIGINAL: Hollowine

Eduardo...On a serious note, maybe get a Venturi instead of the blender. I hardly ever use mine anymore, but it did a great aeration into the decanter.



This

And it is a lot easier than running through Vinturi into individual glasses



penguinoid -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/3/2020 10:43:38 PM)

quote:

ORIGINAL: jmcmchi

quote:

ORIGINAL: penguinoid

I am not sure how good a blender would be for decanting, but if you're going to try I would make the suggestion that you should ensure the blender is really, really clean, and doesn't have food or detergent residues in it. My (admittedly limited) experience with blenders is that they're difficult to clean, and there can be food residues lurking in unexpected places. This could obviously influence the flavour of the wine in unexpected and undesirable ways.


Sounds just like a destemmer [:)]


Which I've also had to help clean occasionally. If you've been blending green vegetables such as kale, however, it might act more like a re-stemmer, if such a thing could exist... [:D][:D][:D][:D]



jonathanknowles -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/4/2020 12:03:53 AM)

It's not a weird question at all. I've thought about trying this with a wine I drink regularly.

Aside from all the concerns about The main problem is I'm not sure my blender is clean enough. Like really clean. Somewhere in a tiny nook or cranny there'll be a bit of garlic or ginger from a recent curry lurking to add some spice to the wine. When this blender dies and is replaced by a shiny new one I might well try it though.




Poppacork -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/4/2020 7:06:36 AM)

I only blend old burgs...wakes em up a bit. [;)]



KPB -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/4/2020 12:14:04 PM)

I think the main issue with a blender is that it might have traces of garlic or other flavorful things from the last time you made hummus or a smoothie.

The minor issue would be that some wines have sediment that can taste a bit bitter once it forms, and you don't want it blended back in.

But if the blender is clean and the wine doesn't have sediment then it could work. I mostly decant younger cabernet wines plus a certain style of southern rhone reds -- ones that seem very hefty. The thing is, though: splash decanting probably gives the same exposure to air as your blender would, without lots of foam, and if the wine is going to improve, the rest is chemistry, not vigorous agitation. A young cabernet from California is going to need 3 or 6 hours (and often a whole 24 hours) to really show its aromas and flavors fully. Blend all you like -- it won't speed things up a ton. This is just a chemical process that advances slowly.



rlp805 -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/4/2020 12:24:56 PM)

Picture this; A roaring fire in the fireplace, candles lit on the table and you place a perfectly cooked steak in front of your wife (or significant other) and then grab the blender to serve the wine....

Ok, I know you could re-pour it into the bottle, but not the sexiest way to handle your wine.



Blue Shorts -> RE: Decanting and a really stupid question (9/4/2020 3:46:52 PM)

quote:

low and slow setting on a blender maybe? but at high speed, i think the heat generated is too much for the wine..


I was thinking the same thing....kind of like using a blade grinder for coffee....generates heat that damages the coffee (wine in this case).



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