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ORIGINAL: wallstreet

I took two clients to dinner at Cafe Martaranno at the Rio…

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ORIGINAL: wallstreet

Now I just take him to Joe's Seafood at Ceasars.  They have the best Filet Mignon in town believe it or not.

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ORIGINAL: wadcorp

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ORIGINAL: wallstreet

Now I just take him to Joe's Seafood at Ceasars.  They have the best Filet Mignon in town believe it or not.

Is that Filet Mignon of crab or lobster?

.

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ORIGINAL: Colonel Lawrence

That's about $1.20 an US gallon (I think that's better than the US? it's a fraction of the cost of the UK and Europe).

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ORIGINAL: Colonel Lawrence

We all drive big engined SUV's…

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ORIGINAL: caeleric

not that this adds anything new to this thread, but restaurant markups are infuriating to me as well. the restaurant may have access to better food ingredients and more expertise in preparing the food than i, which is why i'm ok paying a "high" markup for food prep. but i can pop a cork and pour a glass just as well as the server, so i hate markups.

i just returned from spain and was blown away by the relative reasonableness of their wine pricing. a glass of very decent house wine is almost always less expensive than a can of coca-cola. not only that, i was drinking '95, '96 and '97 grand reserva riojas for anywhere from 25-50 euro per bottle ($32.50 US to $65 US). that is no doubt a markup, but imagine the swill you get served at restaurants in the states for less than $35 a bottle. i was in heaven!

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ORIGINAL: wadcorp

I'm still thinking most restaurants could actually increase sales (and repeat business) if they got their wine prices down to something "in the known universe".

No problem with 1.5X mark-up.

Again, it's the 2X or greater that makes my blood boil.

.

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Hertrich maintains that there is a magic number where a good restaurant wine manager can do a lower markup, sell more wine and make the same amount of profit. “If you pay $50 for a mid-range Burgundy, you can put it on the list for $200 and wait six months for someone to buy it, or you can charge $125 and sell it right away,” he says. “Meanwhile you’ve already paid for it and you have to store it.”

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In August, after more than seven years in business, Holbrook (The Courtyard, at Pine and Clement, in San Francisco's Richmond district near Golden Gate Park cut his markup to 50 percent to match local retail wine prices. Mead and other San Francisco writers, even an Associated Press wire service reporter, wrote hosannas about the restaurant and Mead urged his readers "to go out of your way to patronize The Courtyard.'

Why did Holbrook, who normally took a 100 percent markup, do it? "I got very annoyed at being gouged for wine, seeing a bottle that I knew cost $5 selling for $20. Overpriced wine really disturbed me and people in the Bay Area have such easy access to reasonably priced wine . . . there's no merit to gouging winebuyers. I got angry with the whole thing and decided I'd change it.'

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Chef Michael Chiarello’s one-year old hot spot Bottega has already earned a reputation among the locals for casual elegance and a thoughtful, mostly local wine list. Rightfully, Napa residents were extolling the virtues of the chestnut gnocchi and the chicly restored building, yet no one warned us about the wine prices. I mean, they were borderline ridiculous.

Ridiculously inexpensive, that is. I’ve never seen markups so low in California.

A bottle of Merlot from one of my favorite Napa producers, Frog’s Leap, was listed at $35—one dollar above the current retail price. Some of the more voluptuous valley Cabernets were modestly marked up; Rubicon 2005 was released at $145 and was listed at Bottega for $170, while Tim Mondavi’s Continuum 2006 was released for the same price and listed for $180. A bit saturated with Cabernet after a day of appointments, we chose a lovely young Barolo for $66, marked up only $15 from its release price.

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Think about it: whether the marquee says McDonald's or Maxim's, the beverages they offer have high markup. Although diners complain about wine prices, soda pop, coffee, and iced tea are far more inflated. A McDonald's 24-ounce Coke sells for US$1.49 -- the entire ingredients, cup, lid, and straw cost under US25¢ -- that's very nearly a 600% markup.

Wine consumers are spoiled by the relatively low markup on retail wine, such that independent shops exclusively dealing wine are practically nonexistent, unable to profit enough to sustain their owners. A bottle that wholesales for US$10, for example, might be found selling for US$14 retail. If that same wine is offered at US$30 on a winelist, it would probably raise some hackles. But if that same wine were served at McDonald's, under their business economics, it would be US$60!!!

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For decades now, markups of 2.5 to three times the wholesale price have been the industry norm. According to Wiegand (Ronn Wiegand, a Napa, Calif.-based restaurant consultant who holds the rare Master of Wine degree), such multiples are an economic necessity for most restaurants; anything less and they may have trouble sustaining themselves. But not every wine on the list has to be marked up at the same rate. So long as the average cost per bottle is in the 2.5-to-three-times-wholesale range, list prices for individual wines need not follow any formula. And, in fact, most restaurants that take wine seriously use a system of progressive markups: They generally slap the biggest markups on inexpensive wines and the lowest ones on pricy bottles (the idea being that the closer an expensive wine is to its retail price, the more apt the customer will be to bite).

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ORIGINAL: PSirah Tampa

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ORIGINAL: wadcorp

I'm still thinking most restaurants could actually increase sales (and repeat business) if they got their wine prices down to something "in the known universe".

No problem with 1.5X mark-up.

Again, it's the 2X or greater that makes my blood boil.

.

Although I wholeheartedly agree with you the formula must not work or else SOMEONE would be doing it. I call it discrimination against wine lovers- maybe we can file a class action lawsuit?

There's a restaurant in Tampa called Berns; they likely have the largest wine list in the world (the size of a telephone book for a medium sized city). Berns has a worldwide reputation for wine, and people travel to Tampa just to dine there. They have an interesting approach to pricing their wine.

I would guess that 95% of their customers know little about wine, but 100% know Berns is known for it. Approximately 80% of their customers dine with a bottle (or more) of wine on the table. Berns adds wine to their inventory at an average 350% markup-healthy. They have about 1 million bottles in inventory going back in great quantities into the '70s. Once the bottle goes on the list the price rarely goes up until its sold out. Because they buy so much wine and have such a great variety this can take decades. What this means is you can buy 20 to 30 year old perfectly aged bottles of wine that drink beautifully for $25- $50- a real bargain!

What's really interesting is that VERY few people order this stuff when dining. Who knows what the reasons are- perhaps lack of knowledge, not wanting to look cheap, or just wanting to order a name they know- but 90% of the bottles served are recent releases of something or other that just received a 350% markup!

The restaurant is not stupid- they know there are extreme deals on the list. But they also know that only true wine lovers will look for them. By having these great values on the list (and there are hundreds of them at various price points) the hype is preserved and the sheep come in to order the easily replaced current stuff at high prices!

Imagine that- a restaurant that actually looks out for us wine geeks! The country needs to make it a law.

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ORIGINAL: PSirah Tampa

There's a restaurant in Tampa called Berns; they likely have the largest wine list in the world (the size of a telephone book for a medium sized city). Berns has a worldwide reputation for wine, and people travel to Tampa just to dine there. They have an interesting approach to pricing their wine.

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Bern’s founder, Bern Laxer, traveled the globe extensively exploring, researching and tasting wines that he could bring back and introduce to his guests back home. In time, the cellar grew to be one of the most respected and largest collections in the world. Today, our cellar contains more than 6,800 different selections with more than half a million bottles.
Bern’s Wine Cellar is the perennial recipient of the Wine Spectator Grand Award, the magazine’s highest honor bestowed upon restaurants that display an uncompromising and passionate commitment to quality. According to Wine Spectator, “these lists show serious depth of mature vintages, outstanding breadth in their vertical offerings, excellent harmony with the menu, superior organization and presentation, and 1,250 or more selections.”

Whether you are an oenophile or a novice, Bern’s Wine Cellar will truly impress you -- with more than 6,800 unique wine labels, 5,500 red wines, 1,000 white wines and more than 200 sparkling wines. In addition, we feature about 300 Medeiras, Ports and Sherries by the glass, as well as 200 table wines served by the glass with vintages to 1973.

Because of the breadth of our wine collection, we update our wine list four times a year and currently we are unable to offer our list online.

Our three talented Sommeliers are highly knowledgeable and can recommend the perfect glass or bottle to complement your dinner. If you have questions about the wine list or if you would like to pre-select your wine prior to dinner with us, please email, asksommelier@bernssteakhouse.com

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ORIGINAL: wallstreet

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ORIGINAL: wadcorp

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ORIGINAL: wallstreet

Now I just take him to Joe's Seafood at Ceasars.  They have the best Filet Mignon in town believe it or not.

Is that Filet Mignon of crab or lobster?

.

Best beef in Vegas, but not believe me, try it next time for yourself :)

The roasted corn side dish is amazing.

quote:

ORIGINAL: PSirah Tampa:

Although I wholeheartedly agree with you the formula must not work or else SOMEONE would be doing it. I call it discrimination against wine lovers- maybe we can file a class action lawsuit?

There's a restaurant in Tampa called Berns; they likely have the largest wine list in the world (the size of a telephone book for a medium sized city). Berns has a worldwide reputation for wine, and people travel to Tampa just to dine there. They have an interesting approach to pricing their wine.

I would guess that 95% of their customers know little about wine, but 100% know Berns is known for it. Approximately 80% of their customers dine with a bottle (or more) of wine on the table. Berns adds wine to their inventory at an average 350% markup-healthy. They have about 1 million bottles in inventory going back in great quantities into the '70s. Once the bottle goes on the list the price rarely goes up until its sold out. Because they buy so much wine and have such a great variety this can take decades. What this means is you can buy 20 to 30 year old perfectly aged bottles of wine that drink beautifully for $25- $50- a real bargain!

What's really interesting is that VERY few people order this stuff when dining. Who knows what the reasons are- perhaps lack of knowledge, not wanting to look cheap, or just wanting to order a name they know- but 90% of the bottles served are recent releases of something or other that just received a 350% markup!

The restaurant is not stupid- they know there are extreme deals on the list. But they also know that only true wine lovers will look for them. By having these great values on the list (and there are hundreds of them at various price points) the hype is preserved and the sheep come in to order the easily replaced current stuff at high prices!

Imagine that- a restaurant that actually looks out for us wine geeks! The country needs to make it a law.

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ORIGINAL: CranBurgundy

We had a cheese plate and some other small dishes in a Philly restaurant a few years back, and ordered a 2011 Heinz Eifel Spatlese for $49. Considering it could be bought back then from any retailer for $11 or $12, that was a pretty hefty mark-up.

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ORIGINAL: wadcorp

So resurrecting this old thread because I just can't let this go.

Had dinner at Sullivan's Steakhouse earlier this week. Called to see about corkage, and ends up it isn't allowed.

"No outside wine can be brought in."

Dang. Was hoping to bring an older bottle for our anniversary celebration, but not to be. Since Sullivan's is on the Kansas side of State Line, that's their prerogative.