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Red

2003 Midsummer Cellars Cabernet Sauvignon Mann Vineyard

Cabernet Sauvignon

  • USA
  • California
  • Napa Valley

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Community Tasting Note

  • PIntag wrote:

    October 30, 2021 - 13.5% abv. Recent auction purchase.
    Interesting Napa Cab. There's a little bit of a roasted note that points to the hot vintage, but it's not too bad. Seems kind of tight and wound up still, even on the second evening (stoppered overnight). Acid was pretty high and stuck out a bit. Not the most attractive flavor profile but an interesting drink for the $22 I paid for it.

    7 people found this helpful 730 views

37 Comments

  • seijaro commented:

    10/31/21, 9:58 AM - I’m guessing you liked the wine but I don’t waste time reading a review with no numerical score. Did you like it a lot (93) or just a little (86)? It’s not complicated, it mirrors your grammar school grades: A = 90 and above, B = 80-89, C = 70-79… below that is “Dislike.”

  • PIntag commented:

    10/31/21, 10:04 AM - I usually score the wines I write a note for, but sometimes I don't feel like assigning a score. For this wine, I'd go with a range 87 - 89, definitely not a 90 for me.

  • seijaro commented:

    11/1/21, 9:49 AM - Thank you, that helps!

  • Flyboy commented:

    11/19/21, 3:39 PM - Strange comment

  • River Rat commented:

    11/19/21, 6:03 PM - Dude must be obsessed with points which mean absolutely nothing. He says " I don’t waste time reading a review with no numerical score. " even though he obviously read the note, then wastes his time even more berating you. I would have told him to fuck off and attack some other random user. Douchebag.

  • RichEB1 commented:

    11/19/21, 10:08 PM - 'Strange comment' is a really nice way to put it. One of the most ridiculous things that I've read on CT in a very, very long time would be another way to say it. WTF??

  • S1 commented:

    11/20/21, 4:52 AM - I rate the first comment <70.

  • seijaro commented:

    11/21/21, 1:33 PM - Well I guess it depends on whether you want to add value by helping other users or just see yourself talk. How hard is it to assign a numerical score?

  • seijaro commented:

    11/21/21, 1:41 PM - To Rat: "points mean nothing"? Maybe you should ask Robert Parker, the world's best taster, who popularized the 100-point scale. But I guess you know more about wine than he does. Riiight.

  • RichEB1 commented:

    11/21/21, 2:03 PM - I'm sorry, but I can't tell if you're joking. Are you honestly saying that a random numerical score from someone who you don't know (i.e. you have no clue about their palate or how it aligns with yours) is more valuable than reading the actual written descriptions that they used to breakdown the wine/their experience??

  • Flyboy commented:

    11/21/21, 2:36 PM - Seijaro - it’s clear you prefer to just hear yourself talk. Points are, to mean and many others, meaningless. This included RMP when he was writing. Their only value was to drive sales IMnSHO

  • S1 commented:

    11/21/21, 3:56 PM - @seijaro stop digging

  • seijaro commented:

    11/22/21, 6:24 AM - A score tells me how much YOU liked the wine. After that, the trick is to find raters whose taste reflects yours. It's like movie critics: if Rex Reed liked one I knew I'd hate it, but if Ebert did I watched.

  • guillermo- commented:

    11/22/21, 7:12 AM - Ebert liked The English Patient. That movie sucked.

  • River Rat commented:

    11/22/21, 7:57 AM - If I like a wine I click in the “I Liked It” button. I know, archaic but it works for me. Scores mean nothing and are extremely subjective.

  • yhn commented:

    11/22/21, 4:28 PM - Funny that PIntag said he usually does assign scores, but wasn't confident or whatever here. Wines change over time in the glass, sometimes dramatically to the good or bad. Some wines you just don't have a grasp on how they'll age. A score without a well-written note is useless. A score can help a note, as a crutch or emphasis. This particular note is well written and describes a sub-par wine I'd have no interest buying. Some negatives, as well as redeeming qualities. Easy to see how that would be difficult to rate. Since some people are much more sensitive to some negative traits than others, this is probably a wine that would generate a large range of scores from people sharing the same bottle.

  • seijaro commented:

    11/22/21, 5:45 PM - Guillermo said, "Ebert liked The English Patient. That movie sucked" -- it sure did... nobody's perfect, not even me LOL

  • seijaro commented:

    11/22/21, 5:49 PM - Flyboy said, "Their only value was to drive sales" I'll bet you think the CIA faked the moon landings, am I right?

  • River Rat commented:

    11/22/21, 8:03 PM - Flyboy was right. Points are for shelf talkers that give people an unrealistic view of a wines value. How can a $150 Napa Cab and Apothic Red both garner a 90pt shelf talker? Because points are subjective, but a well written tasting note is a much better gauge of a wines actual value to the taster just as the writers tasting history is a gauge to his or her palate preference.

  • seijaro commented:

    11/23/21, 11:24 AM - Depends on how you use it... when I get an email solicitation for wine (I get a lot of them) the first thing I do is look it up on Cellar Tracker. We are hard markers, our ratings are almost always several points lower than the pros who award points on things like color and aroma. We score almost exclusively on taste. If the CT score is 90 or above, I look further, if it is in the 80s I just delete the email. Numbers are valuable to me.

  • River Rat commented:

    11/23/21, 10:13 PM - LastBottlesWines must love you!

  • seijaro commented:

    11/24/21, 7:10 AM - LastBottles is one of the few I don't get, best is Wine Library in Springfield, NJ. -- lots of deals at sale prices and free shipping. Although they can get a little pesty, it's worth it and I like them.

  • PIntag commented:

    11/24/21, 9:40 AM - You got an email solicitation for this low-production 2003 Napa Cabernet? Or do you have it in your cellar from long ago?

  • seijaro commented:

    11/24/21, 10:03 AM - It's a big cellar... when I receive new allocations like the current crop of 2019s and have to find room, I often find old stuff I let go way too long. Recently found 5 bottles of 1993 Montelena, was astonished that it was still so good, usually they have faded away. Biggest recent surprise, however, was that the mag of 1974 Mayacamas was alive and well :)

  • RichEB1 commented:

    11/24/21, 10:35 AM - Man, first the points thing, and and then saying Montelena cabs usually fade away. I don't know buddy.....you have a very 'unique' take on wine!

  • S1 commented:

    11/24/21, 1:53 PM - @seijaro
    Please post on the CellarTrackerGeneral Discussion forum
    https://www.cellartracker.com/forum/tt.asp?forumid=5&p=1&tmode=1&smode=1
    Or the wine Berserkers Wine Talk forum
    https://www.wineberserkers.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=1
    Rather than polluting CT Tasting notes with discussion which belongs in a discussion forum. Thank you.

  • seijaro commented:

    11/24/21, 2:16 PM - Tried to register there twice without success, gave up.

  • RichEB1 commented:

    11/24/21, 2:42 PM - Welp. I give you points for trying.

    *I'll show myself out.

  • S1 commented:

    11/24/21, 2:53 PM - @seijaro this is not the place for discussion.
    Registering for the CT forum is very simple.

  • River Rat commented:

    11/24/21, 6:34 PM - Even a caveman could do it?

  • River Rat commented:

    11/24/21, 6:35 PM - RichbEB1, I’m 98pts on that comment!

  • seijaro commented:

    11/25/21, 6:07 AM - RichEB1 thinks Montelena doesn't fade? ALL wines fade. They improve in the bottle for varying lengths of time until they reach a plateau of full development. They remain there for varying years, depending on how they were made and stored. Eventually they ALL start to decline, including giants like Lafite. The fruit dries out and eventually mostly disappears.
    I recently found five bottles of the '93 Montelena in my cellar and am enjoying them, the first was 92, next one was 94. But they are less robust and fresh than they were 10-12 years ago when we drank the other seven. All wines fade.

  • RichEB1 commented:

    11/25/21, 7:00 AM - Yep, of course you're correct that all wines fade eventually (except for Madeira, etc). My comment was more around assuming a 93 Montelena would be shot. I'd expect well stored bottles to be drinking in their prime with a long life ahead of them. Either way, I'm glad to hear that you enjoyed the bottles that you found!

  • S1 commented:

    11/25/21, 7:53 AM - @seijaro pls register for a discussion forum and stop commenting here. I’m sick of receiving email notifications. I am now OUT.

  • Cabfrancophile commented:

    11/25/21, 8:03 AM - 'Liked' this tasting note in solidarity with those who chose not to score or don't always score. The description is more important than the score, though points have their place.

  • sunnylea57 commented:

    11/25/21, 11:32 AM - @seijaro

    https://www.wineberserkers.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=184674

  • 3daywinereview.com commented:

    11/26/21, 1:08 PM - sunnylea wish this point guy would join the discussion at wine berserkers as we could get this one going 10 plus pages.

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